Q: And making this album that's so organic, it goes against the things or the way that people had pegged you in the past. I don't even know the words they've used. Dance-folk, or something like that, because you have these sturdy songs and they were combined with beats. What made you want to shift away from doing that this time?
A: I just have no interest in it. It seems to me to be my old self. It was just something I tried when I didn't really know what I was doing. And it was interesting for a minute and I enjoyed it. But it was like, my God, I've been given this gift. I can write songs and sing them. There's only so long I want to play with that in that kind of way. And I did that. And I tried -- I played around with sounds. And you know, maybe it was a confidence thing, as well. I just don't need to add all that extraneous kind of sound. I'm not interested anymore.
Q: So Comfort of Strangers is a new chapter. It's --
A: Oh, definitely. I see the first three albums is a trilogy. And I knew it when Daybreaker pretty much was finished. I was like, all right, that is it. A line has been drawn, I do not want to cross it again. And that's when I made rules for myself. Also, just about the production kind of -- I don't know, the process killing the art, and just going back to painting and back to painting. Keep redoing it until it's kind of unrecognizable. And I just didn't want to do that anymore. I wanted to be braver than that, as well. I mean, it was brave to try stuff out, but in a way, to go with your first draft sometimes and not kind of, I don't know, messing with it. That, to me, is braver, I think. Now, anyway.
Q: Maybe the most orchestrated song on the album is the first single, Conceived.
A: Yeah.
Q: There's a string section. There's a zither. When you tour to support Comfort of Strangers, how do you think you'll arrange these songs?
A: Actually, I didn't record this record, obviously, with my old band. But still, Ted Barnes is going to come with me on the road, I hope. I mean, he has something which may mean he might be busy or something in the end. But for now, anyway. And we've just been kind of playing with the piano against the guitar and kind of doing the kind of harmonics that somehow speak of the string line, which works. But I think also, the other idea I've got is to get a support act that has string players. And then they can just double up with me, just because... why bring a whole string section, when there's only two songs that have strings on them. And as for the zither, I think that's going to be piano. You know, stuff like that. I mean, a marimba, I can't bring a marimba on the road.
Q: And on most of your previous recordings, your partner was Ted Barnes, who you just mentioned a little while ago. On the new album, you're accompanied by musicians who you've never worked with before. Did using these players who were strangers make things unpredictable for you, less comfortable?
A: Well, it's funny. When I told T.J., the engineer that I was going to call the album Comfort of Strangers, his immediate reaction was, “Oh, that's brilliant. It's just like we were when we met. We were all strangers and now look what we've created.” It's like, yeah, we've created this thing that's going to last forever. And we were complete strangers that came together and had this incredible bond and connection.
The thing is, I wanted to lead on this record with my guitar, which is what I did. So basically, I was very lucky, because I had a rhythm section that's beyond compare. But you know, it was all up in the air. The thing is, I have nothing to lose, is the way I felt. And sometimes that's a really inspiring feeling. You know, it freed me.
Q: There's a five-song bonus disc that comes with the early copies of Comfort of Strangers. Were these songs from sessions that kind of paved the way for your approach to the album?
A: No, these were songs that I did, gosh, a year previously, with a guy called M.Ward. And they didn't so much pave the way, it was like I was trying to implement the idea then of this kind of stripped-down, simple idea. But I think what happened for me there and why I'm releasing them is because I think they're beautiful, even though, to some degree, they're demos and they're not really necessarily finished. I wanted them to be heard, because they're really dear to me. But I think at the time, I found -- or felt that it was becoming another person's record. It wasn't what I went -- set out to do. It wasn't as brave a move as I meant it to be. I ended up relying on other musicians more than, perhaps -- and someone like M. Ward, who's pretty much a virtuoso guitar player. It's like, if I'm looking to kind of lead with my guitar, maybe the best thing is not to get someone who's so genius on guitar. You know what I mean? But at the same time, it was an incredible experience. And I learned so much. And I think in that way, I took a lot of my lessons and I implemented them later.
It's funny, because I went in to make a very simple record, but it was a real twisty, turny path to get to make a simple record. It's funny. But I like to think that the record I finally made is‑‑ is -- is of its own. Do you know what I mean? It's a statement of its own. And I think that's so different, the kind of sounds and approaches. But ultimately, the intention was similar to make this very honest, very pure record.
Q: And you make this honest, pure record in New York City.
A: Yeah, and near Times Square. I had to walk through Times Square every day. I mean, in the stinking heat of summer.
Q: So did working in New York affect the process or the outcome, do you think?
A: Definitely. I mean, I just found it -- I was just super excited all the time. It was just-- it was -- everything was -- was -- was -- what's the word? You know. What's the word?
Q: Intense?
A: And exotic and different and every little detail. Like, I'd walk to the studio. I had to walk to it. I was so energized, I'd actually have to walk however many blocks it is from Grammercy to‑‑ up to Times Square, because I was just so -- listening to my IPOD -- and just so alive and vital. It was just -- I don't know. I had a big firecracker up my ass. I was just so excited.
Q: It has to seep in.
A: I think it does. And I think that's one thing. I learned so much over the last two years before I made the record. And I think part of that is -- again, Countenance is like I'm giving it away in the music, whatever is in my head, whatever is in my heart is going to come direct through the music, intravenous, boom. And if I'm not in a good place, then I should not be making music, is the way I feel. And that doesn't necessarily mean -- no, that's not entirely true. I mean, if -- hmmm. I suppose if I was in a really bad place, that could come out in the music in another way with an intensity. I suppose -- it's just got to be honest. Whatever it is has got to be honest. For me, anyway, I think.
Q: You grew up -- or you were born in Norfolk, which is like a rural area of England.
A: Yeah.
Q: And then you moved to London as a teenager. Where is home for you now?
A: London.
Q: So it's not that much different than being in New York. I mean, it is, but it isn't.
A: It's frenetic. But I find it really different. I find London -- I just find the energy there a bit. Creatively... I love being there because I love being around my friends. But creatively, I find it a bit kind of stilted or something. And I found New York to just be -- I don't know. I just loved it. I'd walk -- I mean, I'd walk ten paces and see something or someone or hear something or see something that just -- what the hell is that? I just really enjoyed it.
Q: I was thinking on both the songs Conceived, and Shopping Trolley, you seem at peace with your relationships, even if they don't last. Is that hard-earned wisdom or kind of a temporary Zen outlook?
A: Wow, I mean, it is what it is. I mean, what can you do? You know, it is what it is. And I think that's what Shopping Trolley is basically about. I like telling the story, because it's a good example of what Jim O'Rourke brought. When I came up with that song, originally, I was working with M. Ward. And we did it together. And it was a much more gentle version. And I was always like, there's something not -- there's something...is it lyrical? Is it this? What is it? There's a kind of turnaround or twist in the tail that's not there for me. And I thought it was lyrical. But when I got with Jim, it's not that. Again, it's that nothing-to-lose thing. It's like that big kind of fuck off...
O.K. - it's like a song for me like that is about I am going to do this. It is going to cause me so much pain. It is going to hurt me so badly, but I will laugh about it one day, whatever happens. But I probably will cry a lot before I laugh about it. I don't know. It sounds like a terrible cliché when you say it like that. But, I mean, it's just that kind of thing... sometimes you're compelled to move in certain directions that are really probably, on some level, not going to do you much good, but on another level are going to teach you so much. And it's worth it.
The point is, is that Jim O'Rourke came in and he made it like a big -- wa-a-y like within the music. That's where the energy had to be, the energy had to match the meaning. And I think that's what happened there. And that's what happened a lot with working with Jim O'Rourke. He matched musically and energy that totally complements the song and brings it out in a certain light. And that, to me, is just extraordinary.
Q: We were talking about the lyrics in that song a little bit. Pretty straightforward: "I think I'm going to cry, but I'm going to laugh about it all in time." But there's other lyrics of yours that are pretty dreamy and poetic. Does it bug you when people like me ask you what they mean?
A: Usually, yeah. But then --
Q: But we're so comfortable, it's okay.
A: Well, someone like you is probably going to ask me something that I'll learn from. So -- and maybe show me something back. I mean, so I don't mind if you want to ask me, ask me.
Q: But people come up to you all the time, I'm sure, and ask you about stuff. Are you okay with that?
A: Not really, because I find that if I could say it, I probably wouldn't bother writing about it, which sounds like an old cliché. But I think it's true. You know, it's like, that's pretty much the only way I can make sense of most things is to write about it. And I find it quite hard to have a long informed dialogue about it.
Q: Well, we'll have a short dialogue about the song Heart of Soul.
A: Okay.
Q: Because you seem to sing about a time before everything was bought and sold in that song. Would you have rather lived in another time other than this one?
A: Probably. Yeah. I'm not sure -- I think -- but then the '20s wasn't much better. Maybe -- maybe it's some other, other, other time. Maybe there's never been a time when everything's not bought and sold.
Q: We wouldn't know, since we've only been in this one.
A: Exactly, buying and selling our asses.
Q: Sometimes your music references other songs and musicians. In Heart of Soul, there's a nod to Neil Young, Jackie DeShannon. I think she did Put a Little Love in Your Heart, that song. Maybe even Led Zeppelin a little bit. You're such a big music fan, does that help you understand where people are coming from when they approach you or write to you about your music?
A: If a person -- almost like passing time or whatever wanted to talk to me about it, like I would never dismiss that. It's just -- if a journalist asks I sometimes I find that a bit strange.
Q: While you were making Comfort of Strangers, were there any CDs you were kind of hooked on or that were touchstones?
A: I think Nick Cave's last record, Lyre of Orpheus, and meeting Nick Cave, I did the Leonard Cohen meltdown, the Hal WIlner project. And we toured it in Australia. And I found his kind of grace and general demeanor very inspiring. And I listened to that a lot. Gosh, there's so much. You know, what else did I listen to? I also had just gotten my IPOD, so I was pretty much on shuffle the whole time. So everything, all of my favorite records I was just kind of running through all the time.
Q: Comfort of Strangers is an album full of thoughts and meditations about our origins, where we come from, personal, universal, and how they affect our love and lives. Do you consider yourself a romantic?
A: Yeah, I think I'm a bit of a romantic. But romantics have to be careful not to become cynics. It's like the innocence. You've got to be careful with that whole thing. It's like, well, am I too romantic to get married or something? Am I too romantic to actually have a relationship? You know what I mean? It's like all these people who are actually far too romantic for their own good. It's just like it becomes like this kind of idea and never a reality. And I think -- anyway, maybe I shouldn't be getting so heavy, but, yeah. I guess I'm a romantic, yeah.
Q: I wondered if you could ever envision yourself being married someday, because you sing about ones that keep coming around again. In Comfort of Strangers, there's a lot of people who are in your life and they're spirits remain, but they're not there anymore. Do you think you'd ever get married?
A: Yeah.
Q: See, it wasn't too heavy.
A: No.
Q: I know that you're really into nature and natural things and elements come out on all four of your albums. The sky, water, the stars, the sun, a galaxy, the sea...
A: Trees.
Q: Trees. And then there's the song on the album Feral Children. Do you think that natural states hold the answers to our problems and issues?
A: Definitely, on all accounts. But there again, there's another brilliant example, the fact that we're so removed from our natural state. And also, just, something in terms of medicine. I mean, the fact that there's probably cures for most diseases that come from natural sources that we're not allowed to be privy to or -- I don't know. Maybe I sound a bit kind of conspiratorial. I just think there's many ways we're kept from -- from -- from, I don't know, the truth of nature for money, pretty much.
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