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Q: There's little you can say about Willie Nelson that hasn't been already said. As a performer, singer and songwriter, guitarist and activist, he's part of the fabric of American culture. But you may not know about his new CD "It Always Will Be", so for the next hour we will have an in-depth conversation with the man, right here at his home studio in Spicewood, Texas.
SONG: "It Always Will Be"
That was It Always Will Be, the title track of Willie Nelson's new album and a classic new Willie composition, written from the same heart that wrote countless standards, from Crazy to Night Life, to Funny How Time Slips Away. It is good to see you, Willie.
A: Thank you. You too, Jody.
Q: I know you had some surgery on your left arm for carpal tunnel syndrome a few months ago. When did you know that your arm needed surgery and how are you fairing now with it?
A: I first noticed, you know, it started going to sleep on me at night and that went on for a while. And it was sore and hurting. Both hands, really. Because I was overusing them, you know. I was playing a lot of shows and so I was, you know, paying for it. But I didn't realize how serious it was getting until I finally went to a doctor and they said, "You've got some nerve damage. You're going to need surgery." And so I fought that for a while. Naturally, I didn't jump right into the surgery. I said, "Wait a minute. Maybe we can figure something else out." And I tried resting, I tried this and that. And finally, I decided, well, you know, I can't play the way it is, so I might as well -- because it had gotten to the point where I couldn't play. And I said, "Might as well go for it." So you know, they said six weeks, but it's closer to like three months.
Q: And the first road trip you took after the surgery was your recent tour with Bob Dylan of minor league stadiums. I mean, major road trip.
A: Yeah, which was good, though, because I was opening for Bob and it allowed me to do a shorter show than I normally would do. It was really a blessing in disguise to be able to -- well, in several ways, to be working with Bob Dylan, because we had a great tour. And whoever thought up the idea of doing those baseball fields was genius. Like, $40-45 ticket and kids under 12 free. And it was great.
Q: So you feel like the arm's back up to snuff now?
A: Well, it's almost, 90 percent. And the rest of it's coming back a little bit, you know, each day.
Q: Tell me about the recording process for "It Always Will Be". Who is James Stroud? I know he's the producer, but I'm not familiar with him. And isn't this the first time you've done an album recorded primarily in Nashville in a very long time?
A: Well, yes, it is. I haven't recorded there in -- in fact, this one I did the vocals here and the tracks in Nashville, which I wasn't exactly sure how that might work. I hadn't done that too often in my life. But I had a lot of faith in James Stroud and also the Nashville musicians. So I knew the tracks would be good. And whether I could add the feel or not without the musicians there was a challenge. And I think maybe next time, we'll try it the other way, just to see if there's a difference. But I thought James got the best musicians possible to do this album and help me put together what I think are some good songs.
And I first became acquainted with James' work when he was doing Toby Keith. And come to find out, he'd done some other things. I think he played drums with Jerry Lee Lewis at one time. So he has a good history. And the fact that he is a musician also helps the way his records turn out.
Q: There are these three great new songs that you wrote for this album. The first one we heard, the album's namesake, It Always Will Be. You don't have to write songs to pay the rent anymore, so what motivates you to pick up the pen and paper at this stage of the game?
A: It's more like childbirth (laughs).
Q: How's that?
A: Well, when you get an idea and you know it's a good idea and you are supposedly a songwriter, so what are you going to do? And you start trying to think of reasons not to write it. You know, you've already written this idea with this one or that one, but it doesn't matter. If it's a good idea, it's going to keep bugging you till you do something with it.
Q: Did you hear anyone else's voice also singing It Always Will Be after you finished it? In other words, to cover the song?
A: No. Not that there couldn't be 100 guys do it, but I wasn't thinking that way.
Q: That would be fine with you?
A: Oh, it would be wonderful, yeah.
Q: Are there any covers of your songs that are your favorites that might be a surprise to us?
A: Well, Patsy Cline, Crazy. That's no surprise, I don't guess. Roy Orbison, Pretty Paper.
Q: Oh I hadn't thought about that.
A: Jimmy Hinton's Funny How Time Slips Away.
Q: You do a great version of Tom Waits' song, Picture in a Frame.
A: I love that song, yeah.
Q: What made you decide to record it?
A: Kimmie Rhodes and I had just done it together on our duet album that we put together. And I love the song. And it was her idea. She brought it to the session.
SONG: PICTURE IN A FRAME
Q: Willie, you did some DJ work, I think it was KBOP in Pleasanton, Texas, many years ago.
A: K-B-O-P.
Q: K-B-O-P. When was that? And did you like doing it?
A: Oh, I loved it. I started out at KHBR in Hillsboro, which is 10 miles north of Abbott, where I was born. So when I was still in high school, I had a radio show there, me and my sister and my brother-in-law, a football coach. We all got together and played music on the radio there at KHBR in Hillsboro. When I got down to Pleasanton, when to KBOP, run into a guy named Dr. Ben Parker, who turned out to be a great guy, great friend and gave me a job. The first day there when I went in to audition for the job, he set me down behind the microphone and he gave me some paper with words on it and commercials. And he had me read them. And the first one was "Pleasanton pharmacy, where your pharmaceutical..." -- or let's see. "Precisely and accurately" -- something like that. Had a lot of long words in it. And I wasn't ready for that. So I screwed it up, just about like I did then. But he laughed and gave me the job anyway.
Q: We just heard you singing one of Tom Waits' songs. And on this new album, you record songs written by a pretty diverse group of folks, along with your own songs. Toby Keith, your late friend, Jimmy Day, Lucinda Williams. What's the songcatching process like for you, when you decide to choose someone else's songs?
A: Well, I have to like it, for sure. I don't think I've ever intentionally done a song that I just did not like. And I never thought about it as being commercial or non-commercial. It's just, do I like the song? And these songs, you know, are songs that I like, even though it might look sort of strange since one of the songs on there was written by my daughter, Paula. And another one was written by my son, Lucas. It just happened to be that they were good songs. And the fact that they were my kids gave me another good reason to record 'em.
Q: They fit right in.
A: I think so, yeah.
Q: We mentioned that you recorded a Toby Keith song on this disk. It's a wonderful song called Tired.
A: Yeah.
Q: You guys had a hit song with Beer for my Horses. We actually heard a new Willie Nelson song on Country Radio again. That was a novel touch for those folks. But you and Toby seem like unlikely partners to me. He's a drinker, you're a smoker, you wrote an anti-war protest song, he had an album called "Shock 'n' Ya'll." Do you and Toby ever talk politics?
A: Oh, well, yeah, we're not afraid to talk politics. In fact, we're not really that far apart on politics. His ideas aren't as far-fetched as some people might think. You know, I can't put Toby's business on the street, but I do know that he and I agree on a lot of things.
Q: That's interesting, since the country seems to be split 50/50, I think what's missing is that we've got more in common than we do --
A: This is true. And since it's all our jobs to bring people together, I think if we start looking, we can find a lot of things about each other that are fairly similar.
Q: Someone that you share some traits with, being that she's a songwriter and a singer, is Lucinda Williams.
A: Yes.
Q: And on the new album, we're going to listen to, Over Time, which is a song that Lucinda did on her last album, "World Without Tears." Did it come to your attention just by hearing the record or did you talk to Lucinda about doing a song together?
A: This was a song that James brought to the session, because he had heard it. He thought it was a good idea. Naturally, you know, when I heard it, I loved the idea, too. And we did it right here in this studio, our vocals.
SONG: OVER TIME
Q: This is Always... Willie Nelson, a chance to listen to some of the songs from the new album by Willie called "It Always Will Be." And we're getting to catch up. People are saying, and I'm one of them, that "It Always Will Be" stands with your classic albums. Did you go into this project thinking, this time around I'm going to make a country classic record?
A: No. I went into the project thinking that between James Stroud and myself we could come up with some good songs. And I knew he had the ability to bring the right musicians. And I felt that we could get together and make a good record. And that's really all I was thinking.
Q: In between "solo" Willie Nelson studio albums, the last, I guess, being 2000's "The Great Divide," you've released a disc of instrumentals, a blues project, a couple of live TV show soundtracks, collaborations with friends like Kimmie Rhodes, Ray Price, Paul Buskirk. There's a gospel CD with Sister Bobbie in the wings. But this album is very focused. Do you perceive that now that you've finished it?
A: Well, I think it is more focused. It's headed toward -- honestly, I hope it's headed toward top radio -- country radio. And that's where James Stroud's strong suit is applied, because his sound is played all over the country sounds these days. So that was one reason that I thought it would be a good idea to get James to do the album, because he does have the ability to put together a sound that's called quote-commercial-unquote.
Q: Yet, it's true to you.
A: I'm not opposed to it at all. I think it's a wonderful idea. And if I get an idea that I -- you know, I called them recently and felt that maybe they should think about putting out "The Trouble Maker" album, which they have done.
Q: The next song we're going to hear is another one you wrote fresh, as it were. It's called My Broken Heart Belongs to You. Anything we should say before we listen to it?
A: Yeah. David Anderson, who works with me and travels with me and as far as I knew had never written songs before, brought me kind of a poem with basically the first verse of this song and asked me what I thought I could do with it. So I took what he had brought to me and put a melody to it, wrote another verse or two. And I thought it was a great idea. And it turned out well, I thought.
SONG: MY BROKEN HEART BELONGS TO YOU
Q: Willie, it sounds like your guitar, Trigger, at work on that song.
A: Trigger played. Barked a little.
Q: I know you said if it could talk, you'd have to shoot it, but I want to get -- I'm thinking Paul McCartney's Hoffner, BB King's Lucille, Trigger. These are some of the best-known guitars ever. What model is it and when did you get it?
A: I think it's an N-20 Martin. And I got it from Shot Jackson in Nashville. And that had to have been 40 years ago.
Q: When you started having people sign it and then the hole began to wear away, did you know all along that this was going to be your main instrument through thick and thin?
A: Well, I knew when I first played it that it was going to be, before it had the first autograph or scratch on it. I knew that this was the guitar I was looking for. It had the tone that I was looking for. And it was one that I could play either acoustic or electric. I could sit around the house or the bus and play it and hear it and enjoy the sound, because it has, as far as I know, the greatest sound of any acoustical guitar. And -- for me. I don't know, there's a lot of opinions out there. But I liked the Martin classical. And this particular one has a special tone.
Q: That's for sure. Along with Trigger, another Willie Nelson tradition is that you open your shows with Whiskey River. But I understand, though, that on your recent tour with Bob Dylan, you started with a different song.
A: I've been opening the show with Promiseland, and I thought it was sort of appropriate to bring it back. And it's another one of those attempts to bring people together, rather than separate, you know. Whiskey River kind of does that, too, but there's always time for that.
Q: We can all agree on Whiskey River.
A: Yeah (laughs).
Q: I bet it was startling for some of your fans when they got there and the concert didn't start out right away with Whiskey River, just as it's shocking when you don't make it out for a 4th of July Picnic. Have you ever been headin' for one of those picnics wishing, "gosh darn it, I just wish I was home shooting off firecrackers or simply not out here in the heat?"
A: Well, the first ones were very exciting, because I was doing most of the promotion. And so I was involved in everything. And even one I got so involved in promoting it that I was late getting it started, the one in Gonzales. I was up all night promoting it with radio stations in San Antonio and just barely made it to get to Waylon's show to close it. And I think Leon (Russell) was after that. So I got to sit in, but never did do my show. So in recent years, we've had, you know, guys really that had more time and better qualified to promote than I was.
Q: But when you're on your way out there most 4th of July's, you're like, "Alright. This is what I want to do today. This is -- we're going to have a good time."
A: It's a challenge, I guess, just to see how this one's going to turn out. |
Willie on his carpel tunnel problems
