JODY: The first two songs on Open, "I Did It All For You" and "Dragging Hooks", they're both dark songs. They deal with death. And then the title of the album is Open, which is sort of a bright word. That seems to be kind of the duality of this record.

MICHAEL: Yeah, very much so. I mean, the idea of calling it Open, as well. There's a dual sense to "open" as well. I mean, the initial idea is something which is open or somebody that's open is a very positive thing. But then when you are open, you're also very vulnerable to things that come in through whatever, the door. And so there's also a menacing side to it, as well, I think. And the songs very much reflect both those sides. It sort of starts very dark, this record, and gets brighter as you go along, hopefully a little bit brighter (laughs)

MARGO: Really bright! (laughs).

JODY: Rivers and bodies of water play a large part on this record and on most of your records...

MICHAEL: That's true. I think river, in general, the symbol and metaphor of the river is something that's been certainly in song and literature forever as a very strong metaphor for life. It's something that's always flowing, always changing. It's obviously very important for life, specifically, you know. That's where all our communities and our cities have grown up on rivers, obviously, for transportation and also just for the source of water. It's hard to get away from it. If you listen enough to our songs, if you like the river it always pops up. It's always there.

JODY: Margo, do you think that Open represents a new beginning for Cowboy Junkies because it's a new business situation now' It's the first studio record you've done since leaving Geffen and also just the record itself is very aggressive musically.

MARGO: Well, yes and no. I mean, it's interesting because on -- this is just the Junkies side of it, just the four of us. It's just one more record in a long line of records, I hope. And at least another 20 to follow. So it's just another record that we're writing at this moment. And it's recorded in that way, too, just how we are at this moment, how we feel. And those decisions that have created this record are based on just that. But on a business side, yeah, I agree with you. To me, anyway, it is a new beginning. It is a new start. There's a lot -- I have a lot of hope in this record that I'd like it to work to prove we can do this without major labels and all the involvement that we've had in the past, just to be able to say, you know, it can be done this way. To show other bands, too, that you don't have to have all the trappings in order to make a career. You might not sell millions, but just enough to pay the rent is good.

JODY:I have some questions that came from your fans through cowboyjunkies.com that I'd like to share with you. The first addresses what might be the continuity amongst the Junkies' records. The question came from Jason Lent. And he says, "On previous albums, location greatly influenced the creative process -- Maiden's Mill, Sharon Temple, Athens -- where was Open worked on and how did it influence the song?"

MICHAEL: That's a good question. A lot of these songs were written in the country, as well, near Maiden's Mill where "Miles From Our Home" was written. I had a place up there for six months, my wife and I. And so that's why a lot of the imagery is very, you know, (the lyrics have) a lot of natural environment imagery in it. Environment has a big part, in, certainly in the writing process. It's what I stare at while I'm writing a song. That's how I write songs. I basically have to shut myself off from the world for months on end and just sort of take in what's around me and then also ruminate on what's going on in my life outside of this sort of little bubble of songwriting. But certainly, the influences and the metaphor that I tend to then draw on are directly in front of me. So if I'm in the country writing, then the natural environment will have a big affect on it. But the recording of it was really done in Toronto, in downtown Toronto. And it was done -- it's more reflective of, of the way we approached the record, which was recording it with a live band, our live band which we had on the road for two years, a seven-piece band. And it's just bringing that band off the road right into the studio and recording. So we'd write two or three songs, we'd go out on the road for a couple of weeks, come off the road, just set up in the studio, play. For two days. Go away. So there was never really any sort of sitting back and analyzing tape. It was really just, "Let's just play with music and we'll see if we have a record later. Don't worry about what's in tune, what's out of tune. Let's just pretend we're playing live." And I think it's really reflected in the record. It's a very dynamic-sounding record. And I think that's because of that.

JODY:A lot of times when you ask songwriters about their songs, they might say, Well, there's some of it - me in there, but I write about characters. "Bread and Wine", there's a vision of infidelity in this song. Then there's kind of a Biblical reference. It makes it hard to believe that these are purely the thoughts of characters because they're drawn so well. And Michael, you could get in trouble answering that question. So, I throw it to you, though.

MICHAEL: I'm a good Catholic boy. You know, they are -- well, they're in my head. My wife certainly looks at me when she listens to this song and goes, "Anything you want to tell me'" There is a line in that song which refers to, you know, I could turn this into fantasy or something like that. So that's basically what it is. But, you know, all the songs on this album relate to being at a certain place in one's life and sort of reflecting on where one is. And you know, in-in-inin the pop culture cliché way it's basically about mid-life crisis. And, you know, this is that side of it. It's that whole sort of -- the looking at where one is with one relationship and sort of figuring out, well, where can I go from here, if anywhere. And that's it. And then the Biblical references come back because I'm a Catholic boy. I was raised Catholic. And whenever I think those thoughts, I have to be punished for them. So I'm taking communion right away.

JODY:Well, since you mentioned your upbringing, we have another question that came through the Cowboy Junkies' website. It came from Tim in Big Rock, Illinois. And he says, "What do your parents think about your success?"

MARGO: Oh, they're relieved. You know, in the early days when we were a young band just starting off, they had three of their children in a van, driving around America, making no money, sleeping on people's floors and driving on highways in the middle of the night for many hours on end. So three of their children was half of their children. They had six of them. So it was frightening for them.

And we weren't all that young, either. We were sort of in our later 20s when the band started off. As far as my parents were concerned, this was something we should have gotten out of our systems when we were 18, you know (laughs). So the fact that it worked to the point where we can pay our mortgages and feed our families on our music is a great relief to them. And also, they like our music and they can share in it. And they can bring their friends to our shows and not be too embarrassed by the whole thing. Yeah. So it's fun, it's good.

MICHAEL: I don't think they're too keen on this record.

MARGO: Yeah. (Lots of laughter!)

JODY:You're in trouble with your wife. You're in trouble with your parents. But you're more than 15 years into a journey that involves three siblings. How has the music journey of Cowboy Junkies changed your relationship as family, at least amongst the two of you and Peter'

MARGO: That's a good question. You know, I think we've been really protective of the family side of our lives. We haven't really -- you know, it's never been something we've talked about or set out rules to protect, but I think we've all known that protecting the family side of our relationship was something we really had to be careful about and not to mix business and family. If Cowboy Junkies falls apart because Michael and I start hating each other, there's a lot of other people that are going to get hurt besides just the band. There's all my other brothers and sisters and my parents. So it's been something we've been really careful about. And I think the way we've done that is just that when we are working, we're working. And we have that relationship and those guidelines in that relationship. And then when we're family, when we're at my mom's house or hanging out, that's what we are. You know, I mean, he's just my evil older brother then you know (laughs). And we don't talk business at the family dinner table or anything like that. We leave that for Monday you know. And so it's sort of just worked out that way. And as I say, family is important to all the siblings. It's not just us. My sisters are my best friends. So we all have this very tight group and it's important to us.

JODY: The relationship with you and Michael especially is interesting because Michael writes the lyrics and then, Margo, you have to sing them. My question is: How do you get inside these lyrics that you didn't write and then you have to sing' Do you have to live with them a while' Do you have to play them for a while'

MARGO: It depends on the song. Some songs he hands me and, you know, I'd almost think that he was writing from my head. I often say he doesn't even know what he wrote, because it's so personal to me. And I know exactly how I want to sing the song and how I want to express it and what it means. Even if it isn't what he intended, I know how I want it to sound. And the best part about our singer/songwriting situation is that Michael has never had such a big ego that he's had to tell me how to sing it or it must be this way. You have to express it this way. He's allowed me to put my own interpretation on it. So when I get that kind of song, it's so there, it's just right there. There are other songs that I'm not -- I don't have any personal experience with. I don't --It means nothing to me as far as my own life. So at that point, I become a storyteller. And I'm just telling the story and I hope that it, it touches somebody else's life experience and they bring their experience to it. The listener.

And then there are some songs I don't know what he's talking about! (Laughs). And there's two things with those songs. Sometimes I just approach it from -- as if I'm just singing Italian. And I just listen to the rhythm of the words and the music that the boys are giving me and sing it from that perspective of just -- just rhythm. And that can be really fun to do. And other ones, if I can't do that and I'm just not getting it, I don't know what it means, I can't connect with the music because I just don't feel it, I'll ask him and sort of say, "Can you throw me a bone here." He'll um, he's not -- I wish he'd tell me what the song means, just tell me how to sing it (laughs). That would make it easier for us all. He'll usually give me sort of a guideline, go in this direction. Or he'll just say, "You're going in the right direction. You're doing okay." And what will often happen, is several months on the road or several years later, I'll be singing it and it will just dawn on me what this song means. It's, it's -- you know, right in the middle of the show, I want to stop and go "Oh, I got it. I know what it means." (Laughs) It's fun.

JODY: And that happens to us as listeners.

MARGO: Yeah, I think it does. And that's, to me, what's so intriguing about Michael's songwriting is that it's not always so obvious. And it -- you know, on our website there's a lot of times, which I love, where people are discussing certain lyrics and then everybody writes in what they think it means. And it all makes sense. You know, you interpret a song with your own life experience, so it's going to mean something different to you than it will to me. And you know, it's fine.

JODY: "I'm So Open" is not exactly the title track to the new album Open, but a central song to the themes that, that the album deals with. And Michael, I'm not going to ask you to tell us exactly what the song is about. But is part of it about just being open to all that life has to offer'

MICHAEL: Yeah. And that's why it's one of the central songs on the album. The theme of this record being, you know, hitting a certain point in one's life and trying to figure out where you're at and looking forward and looking backwards and looking at what's at your feet. And trying to make sense of it all. And that really -- that's what that song is about. That sort of search, that sort of head-spinning search, where you don't really know where to focus.

MARGO: You don't even necessarily have the answers.

MICHAEL: Yeah.

MARGO: You know, I mean, I think ["I'm So Open"] for me, is filled with -- like Michael says, if you are open, you're also open to -- you're more vulnerable. And in this song, there's a feeling of not being quite sure of whether you want to be all that open, whether you want to answer these questions, you know, so...

MICHAEL: And I think what does happen in that song, the -- and the reason the title is "I'm So Open", if there's a conclusion, it is, you know, you don't necessarily know the answer to these, but the way to find those answers or to figure it out is to remain open, to be vulnerable. That's the only really way to even come close to figuring it all out. So I think that's sort of the pivotal point in the record, in a way.

JODY: There was one question that came through the website that dealt with the theme of the album. This is from John Hays in Tallahassee, Florida, who says, "How did you come about using the Venus Flytrap for the cover? Is there any symbolism between it and the theme of the work?"

MICHAEL: Oh, without a doubt. You know, it's a very weird relationship that we have with our designer, David Houghton. He's done all our design work since Caution Horses. And I was sitting with him one night and discussing the upcoming record. And I gave him two titles. And one of them was Open.

He said, "I think I might have" -- and he hadn't heard any music yet. He said, "I think I might have an idea for that." And he came the next day and he had the Venus Flytrap. And it was just perfect because it -- you know, it's beautiful. It's really a beautiful, stunning image and a stunning plant and creature. At the same time, it's incredibly menacing. It eats things. And so this -- there's that sort of a catch-phrase of being menacingly beautiful, which I think really describes the music quite a lot on this record. There's a real beauty to it, to some of it, but it's also pretty dark and menacing. So it seemed to capture it perfectly.

JODY:Michael do you and Margo work out a song before you present it to Peter and Alan and the rest of your extended band?

MICHAEL: Yeah. Normally, what happens is I'll write the song just like we heard on acoustic guitar, except I'm the one singing it. And then I sit with Margo and I introduce it to her or I put it on tape for her. And then I go in with Pete and Al. And the three of us sort of work out just a general feel of the song, the vibe of it. Sort of the atmosphere. Sometimes it'll change quite radically and sometimes it will just augment what I'm doing on acoustic. And then the four of us will get together. Margo will come in and begin to -- we'll just begin to form it as a unit. And that's sort of like the -- that's the -- where it turns into a Cowboy Junkie song is when the four of us kind of get the overall feel and vibe of the song. And then depending on who we're using on the song as far as backup musicians or who we're using on the recording or the live playing, we'll get them into the studio and into our rehearsal space and just, again, be very, very loose about it. Just sort of play it. You know, maybe I'll make a couple of suggestions for instrumentation. But I try not to even do that. I'd rather our players just find their own space and their own ideas. It's usually a much more exciting process and it's usually much more creative and usually you get better stuff out of it.